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Thread: Best way to draw this wall?

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    Best way to draw this wall?

    I have a wall that is 25 cm thickness and I need to draw this wall over a cad link, picking this wall's lines will let the columns go inside the wall (These lines are not broken or split at column edges it just passes over the columns in cad, bad cad drawing). I do not have access to the cad file to trim them up..what is the best way to draw these walls..
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Best way to draw this wall?-wall.png  

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    Quote Originally Posted by WorldDue View Post
    what is the best way to draw these walls..
    IMO, never use CAD in Revit for Revit content, especially not using the Pick Line tool. Figure out where the wall goes and create it from scratch in Revit. You'll have much less consternation in the future that way...
    cganiere likes this.

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    Senior Member Andres Franco's Avatar
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    hi Worldue, as recommended by Dave Jones it's better to not do that because of file pollution with CAD content, but If you don't have any chance to do that way you'll still able to draw walls and using some Revit commands like SE to snap to the end of lines and so on, nevertheless at the column intersections I'm afraid that you'll be obligated to split the walls and erase the part you don't need or try to draw the walls till the end of each segment letting enough place to put your columns, with a CAD file you'll be able to align object by using the lines in the CAD file as reference to obtain the same angle, hth

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Jones View Post
    IMO, never use CAD in Revit for Revit content, especially not using the Pick Line tool. Figure out where the wall goes and create it from scratch in Revit. You'll have much less consternation in the future that way...
    Really, you prefer to redraw the entire thing using a paper plan rather than "tracing" the architects plan?
    I've not had problems in most cases with the archi plan and using pick lines, and often I can model 1000 times faster than following a paper plan.
    Of course you are putting faith in the accuracy of someone else, but the architect is the one contractually responsible for the geometry....so...if he doesnt have it right then there are larger problems on the project....

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    Forum Addict elton williams's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karalon10 View Post
    Really, you prefer to redraw the entire thing using a paper plan rather than "tracing" the architects plan?
    I've not had problems in most cases with the archi plan and using pick lines, and often I can model 1000 times faster than following a paper plan.
    Of course you are putting faith in the accuracy of someone else, but the architect is the one contractually responsible for the geometry....so...if he doesnt have it right then there are larger problems on the project....
    pick lines on cad. NFW.
    Ive never known such accurate software to be so affected by human error.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karalon10 View Post
    Really, you prefer to redraw the entire thing using a paper plan rather than "tracing" the architects plan?
    I've not had problems in most cases with the archi plan and using pick lines, and often I can model 1000 times faster than following a paper plan.
    Of course you are putting faith in the accuracy of someone else, but the architect is the one contractually responsible for the geometry....so...if he doesnt have it right then there are larger problems on the project....
    Ive never won the lottery, either, but that doesnt mean its not possible to win the lottery.

    Yes, id rather redraw the architects plan by hand, because i HAVE seen (first hand) the abnormalities that cane come out of Pick Lines on CAD, even when its drawn by someone who knows how to use CAD properly. Has nothing to do with the architect *having it right* it has to do with differences in the software.

    Once youve experienced it, you wont ever trace a CAD file again either.

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    If you MUST trace...don't use Pick Lines. If you do you automatically inherit the same subtle inaccuracy the link's element has. I have traced (or will consider tracing) linework in a linked DWG but, IF I do, I only snap to the first endpoint of a line. I let Revit's own notion of direction/orientation cues guide the second point. If you snap to the first point and then no snap icon appears at the other end that's a clue something is wrong, a tiny bearing discrepancy. The more that happens the more worried I get about relying on that file, though I'm always worried about any DWG being reliable.

    Generally the time we think we are saving by picking lines or tracing is lost once we realize we've inherited a bunch of noise...and its usually far too deep into the project when it becomes obvious that something is wrong. If we attempt to create the model treating the DWG source like a PDF drawing we'll bump into mistakes pretty quickly too.
    Last edited by Steve_Stafford; December 21st, 2017 at 09:04 PM. Reason: fixed spelting and word choice

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    Moderator cellophane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve_Stafford View Post
    If you MUST trace...don't use Pick Lines. If you do you automatically inherit the same subtle inaccuracy the link's file has. I have traced (or will consider tracing) linework in a linked DWG but, IF I do, I only snap to the first endpoint of a line. I let Revit's own notion of direction/orientation cues guide the second point. If you snap to the first point and then no snap icon appears at the other end that's a clue something is wrong, a tiny bearing discrepancy.
    This.

    I have to deal with far more CAD underlays than I care to admit and this is the best way to still at least gain some benefit from the CAD while letting Revit do what it is good at.

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    Member DavidLarson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karalon10 View Post
    Really, you prefer to redraw the entire thing using a paper plan rather than "tracing" the architects plan?
    I've not had problems in most cases with the archi plan and using pick lines, and often I can model 1000 times faster than following a paper plan.
    Of course you are putting faith in the accuracy of someone else, but the architect is the one contractually responsible for the geometry....so...if he doesnt have it right then there are larger problems on the project....
    I wouldn't even trace my own work let alone trust somebody else.
    cellophane and DaveP like this.

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    OK Guys, there is being careful, and then there is being pedantic.
    Sure, if I notice revit giving me alignment warnings I end up stopping pick lines, and using the end point method.

    I can say from personal experience that pick lines rarely causes issues and they are quickly identified in early phases as revit will even warn me that lines are off vertical. Also usually there are some warning signs with the cad file when you zoom lines will change position graphically on the screen, and other Strange behaviours. (Which often comes down to the export not being done properly from programs like archicad - and is often fixed by "cleaning" the cad source file a bit using "flatten" and "overkill" will often resolve it and in other cases the source file just needs to be rotated a half a degree to make it "square")

    If you choose to ignore the warnings then you will identify the problem later when you start to place sections, or start to place dimensions that wont snap because Nothing is perpendicular to your views. Sure these are problems that can be avoided by not using pick lines and redrawing "manually" from a paper plan beside you - but what you also get is a massive reduction in productivity.

    In all cases, the source is important. At some point you place some faith in the competence of your project partners capabilities otherwise what are you going to take on the entire project yourself?

    So if you don't place faith in the cad plan, at what point are you going to place faith in your project partners?
    Do you use a civil plan to make your topo surfaces? Or do you plan on calculating all the triangulations yourself? Because if you use a surveyors plan you are accepting his work as accurate - its no different to the architect plan, or another contractors plans - you are not responsible for their errors but of course you want to take responsibility for the accuracy of your work but at some point each to their own discipline and when you start creating topo surfaces without using the surveyors plans you do realise that you are actually taking responsibility (legally) for any faults that you may create on your version of the plan? The same goes for an architects plans, if I start redrawing and "correcting" what I consider faults - when the architect is sued because the spaces are not what was shown to the client you have in fact taken responsibility for faults.

    If you find faults you should be letting your contractors know about them, of course the end goal is a "perfect" project on site but when things go pear shaped the last thing I want is to be blamed for having "fixed" Something that I thought was wrong but was actually the design intent. There is a fine line to be tread there.
    Last edited by Karalon10; December 22nd, 2017 at 07:59 AM.

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