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    #1

    Modeling > Reference Plane Align & Constrains

    Hello Revit users!
    Usually when I create a model in Revit (not necessarily a family), I use reference planes as guides to constrain all other elements on them. For example, I may lay out the perimeter of my building and then align and lock walls, floors, ceilings and roofs, even area boundaries on those reference planes. So, if there is need for change, I know that everything is controlled from my reference planes, and I can move them around to get the shape I want.
    But there is a problem I encouner.
    Often, there is the need to change the orientation of a plane, let’s say 5 degrees. If I rotate it all the constrains are gone. If I draw a guide and align my existing reference plane, all constrains that are not associated with a sketch-based object are being unlocked. How can one change the orientation of a plane or grid without losing all the constrains? Hi5 anyone found a workaround to this issue?
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    #2
    The rule we have in our office is:
    Locking is for Families, not for Projects
    In my experience, the downsides of locking a lot of things in the project environment causes FAR more problems than benefits.
    I'll give Grids and Levels a pass, but beyond that, you very soon start running into circular constraints and either can't move something at all, or move a whole bunch of things you didn't intend to.
    Last edited by DaveP; June 1, 2018, 06:19 PM. Reason: typo
    Dave Plumb
    BWBR Architects; St Paul, MN

    CADsplaining: When a BIM rookie tells you how you should have done something.

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      #3
      There is a simple workaround. Model it correctly. That means no locking anything
      ​My ID was stolen. Now I'm only called Dav

      Comment

        #4
        +1 for not locking anything in the project environment.

        Sent from my Phablet. Please excuse typos... and bad ideas.

        Aaron Maller
        Director
        Parallax Team, Inc.
        Aaron "selfish AND petulant" Maller |P A R A L L A X T E A M | Practice Technology Implementation
        @Web | @Twitter | @LinkedIn | @Email

        Comment

          #5
          I was disheartened by your replies.
          Let me explain why I lock objects in the project environment.
          I used to lock everything on walls and indeeed there where problems, because it was impossible to remember which was the "master" objects on which everything else was locked on. So I ended up with curcular constraints as you described.
          So I switched to drawing reference planes and now I know that everything is aligned on them. I never get an error when moving a reference plane, and my model always responds as expected, as long as the movement is purely translational.
          This can save much time, because you no longer have to edit, say 20 objects including walls, beams, columns, floors, ceilings, roofs, area boundaries among others, independently to get the result you need.
          If only there was a way to be able to rotate the plane as well, it would be pert.
          Besides, isn't parametric design a benefit BIM is supposed to offer?

          Comment

            #6
            Originally posted by ivm View Post
            Besides, isn't parametric design a benefit BIM is supposed to offer?
            yep, you're right about that. However the adjective "parametric" and "BIM" definitions say nothing about "locking" anything. Quite the contrary I think. Both allow for the free (read: non locked) flow of geometry and information.

            That said, you're free to lock anything to anything in any Revit environment that you like. The responses to your OP are just some really smart Revit gurus stating that there could be issues if you do.

            Carry on...
            I'm retired, if you don't like it, go around!

            Comment

              #7
              Originally posted by ivm View Post
              I was disheartened by your replies.
              Let me explain why I lock objects in the project environment.
              I used to lock everything on walls and indeeed there where problems, because it was impossible to remember which was the "master" objects on which everything else was locked on. So I ended up with curcular constraints as you described.
              So I switched to drawing reference planes and now I know that everything is aligned on them. I never get an error when moving a reference plane, and my model always responds as expected, as long as the movement is purely translational.
              This can save much time, because you no longer have to edit, say 20 objects including walls, beams, columns, floors, ceilings, roofs, area boundaries among others, independently to get the result you need.
              If only there was a way to be able to rotate the plane as well, it would be pert.
              Besides, isn't parametric design a benefit BIM is supposed to offer?
              "Parametric Design" doesnt only mean *a bunch of stuff has to move automatically.* The goal is "automation when the automation makes us faster."

              Have you been on a project with ten people, where everything is locked to other things, and 9 people are trying to reverse engineer what someone else locked? I have. It doesnt make the team faster.

              The goal is for the ENTIRE PROJECT to be done faster and better. Not each individual task.
              Aaron "selfish AND petulant" Maller |P A R A L L A X T E A M | Practice Technology Implementation
              @Web | @Twitter | @LinkedIn | @Email

              Comment

                #8
                I have a related question about the Revit families I use at my company - currently any time a family is used to align the product ( cabinet stretches ) - first we thought the box of the cabinet was made in wrong category ( furniture) later duplicated the box to casework ( category) but the issue remains the same .. the family stretches while aligning - where as it should just move to the destination. ANY SUGGESTIONS what could be going wrong .

                Comment

                  #9
                  Those families probably have Instance parameters controlling the sizes.
                  You'll need to change them to Type parameters
                  Add Shape Handles to a Loadable Family
                  https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/revit-products/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/2015/ENU/Revit-Customize/files/GUID-C30A7EFC-3030-4E9D-A305-C66B50E1DF75-htm.html
                  You can add shape handles to a loadable family that display when the family is loaded into a project.
                  Dave Plumb
                  BWBR Architects; St Paul, MN

                  CADsplaining: When a BIM rookie tells you how you should have done something.

                  Comment

                    #10
                    ohh - well the person who made the revit families for our cabinet company - made it thinking that the families sizes could change as per user needs - Height Width and Depth , right , left , top and bottom are always kept in instance parameter - so if they were to be controlled and instead if we provide the types of families things would get easier you mean.

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