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Nested Door Family - Header Help

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    #1

    Nested Door Family - Header Help

    Hi Guys,

    I'm getting the hang of creating nested parts for the doors. I built them in generic family then hosted them in Parent door family. I like it. Still need to create more panels ect. Still need to the windows too.

    Now I have 3 questions:

    1 - I would like to add the structural headers in the parent family. So I don't have to add it every time I add a door somewhere on the plan. I tried to have the width follow the width of the door, but whenever I change the size of the door, it breaks the constraints. I can't figure out why.

    2 - I also can't have the header move up / down when changing the height of the door. I tried to input a formula, but it didn't work. I typed in Door Unit Height + HeaderHeight into the header type, it just says inconsistent units. I've never used the formula before so I'm still new to this part.

    3 - I would reorganize the order and/or move into different group paramenter in the Family Types in the family then reupload it into the project file, it doesn't update the properties browser, any reason why? I even delete the door off the project and tried again, same thing. Do I need to start all over again creating a new parent family and make sure I put it in right the first time?

    I attached the door family for you to look at.

    Many Thanks.
    Attached Files
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    #2
    Be aware of how visibility graphics are handled with something like this - Because the elements are shared their visibility will be controlled under generic models, not doors, which will likely be confusing if others are using your doors.

    <Family Type> Parameters can't be fed length parameters. The formula needs to be in the "HeaderHeight" parameter =Door Unit Height + DoorJambWidth

    Regrouped parameters show up in a project for me on a fresh load, or when loaded with "overwrite parameters" (which can cause other issues). When you deleted itdid you remove any of the shared parameters? that might make a difference.
    Julie Kidder
    Architect + BIM Director
    Hartman + Majewski Design Group

    Comment

      #3
      I'm just the one man show, so I don't have to worry about other people using my door. I added filters in each view template to control the visibility for each doors and it works great even with the header, took me a while to figure that part out trying to find the right naming/parts.

      Awesome! That was the right formula, I didn't think about the doorjambwidth part. Thank you! Got that working great, now what about the width wise?

      I still can't get the regrouped parameters to work right. I even deleted everything that is associated to the door. I loaded it in my template, perhaps I shouldn't have done that yet since I was still testing it. I loaded it in a different template project and everything looks right. So it's something in my template, even loading it with overwrite parameters still doesn't make a difference, guess I need to dig around and find the source.

      Comment

        #4
        For the parameters to reorganize, you need to add the shared parameters as project parameters to your project under the group you want. The shared parameters in the loaded family will move to match. Then, save the family from the project and you should be all set.
        Greg McDowell Jr
        about.me/GMcDowellJr

        Comment

          #5
          I think the issue with the width lies in how structural families behave, but I don't modify them much and haven't tried nesting them. You might be able to get to work by adding another parameter, have that control the geometry and report to cut length; otherwise you could make that a generic model too.

          Edit: what changes when you drag it is the extension - you might be able to apply a formula to add or subtract to that, and keep the initial length very short, but it's not ideal and could break.
          Last edited by jmk; May 10, 2017, 11:25 PM.
          Julie Kidder
          Architect + BIM Director
          Hartman + Majewski Design Group

          Comment

            #6
            I wouldn't nest structural content. It behaves badly for all sorts of reasons, including lengths and heights.

            I would make everything nested inside a door... A door component. Not that I've done a lot of these, or anything.


            Sent from my LON-L29 using Tapatalk
            Last edited by Twiceroadsfool; May 11, 2017, 12:55 AM.
            Aaron "selfish AND petulant" Maller |P A R A L L A X T E A M | Practice Technology Implementation
            @Web | @Twitter | @LinkedIn | @Email

            Comment

              #7
              Originally posted by GMcDowellJr View Post
              For the parameters to reorganize, you need to add the shared parameters as project parameters to your project under the group you want. The shared parameters in the loaded family will move to match. Then, save the family from the project and you should be all set.
              Thank you, got it working now. That was a good ah ha moment for me!

              Originally posted by Twiceroadsfool View Post
              I wouldn't nest structural content. It behaves badly for all sorts of reasons, including lengths and heights.

              I would make everything nested inside a door... A door component. Not that I've done a lot of these, or anything.

              Sent from my LON-L29 using Tapatalk
              Hmm Ok, What would you suggest as an alternative or you always just add each header in manually after doors/ windows are placed?

              Ya, I downloaded your door and it's :thumbsup: but also a lot of info in there that I try to backtrack and learn from it.
              Last edited by sknsnw9; May 11, 2017, 01:03 AM.

              Comment

                #8
                Honestly? I would place them all after the fact, yes. Maybe even use Dynamo to do it.

                IF I was going to put them in the components, however:

                1. I would make them generic models, or door components. Probably gm since they aren't really part of the doors. But structural content doesn't handle being nested and constrained well at all. They break.

                2. If you head to my old Doors thread, you'll see that I nest the frame in to the parent door. I would want the headers nested in the frames, because the opening is dependant on the frames, not the size of the door. Transoms. Sidelights. Etc.

                If I were you I'd want to rethink your whole strategy, as a nested header in just a door family without everything else nested, is a waste.

                Sent from my LON-L29 using Tapatalk
                Aaron "selfish AND petulant" Maller |P A R A L L A X T E A M | Practice Technology Implementation
                @Web | @Twitter | @LinkedIn | @Email

                Comment

                  #9
                  Alright, I'll rethink my strategy then! Guess for now I will keep doing what I've been doing, placing the headers in after doors and windows are put in. I don't know how to use Dynamo yet. Didn't realized that structural doesn't like to get nested. I did keep noticing that it keeps breaking no matter how I change the mapping, locking one end etc. Thanks for the tips.

                  Comment

                    #10
                    This may be a dumb question, but how do you put headers in a family when the family doesn't know where the structure of the wall is located? Is that another parameter you'd add to the door family?
                    Greg McDowell Jr
                    about.me/GMcDowellJr

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