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    Revit needs "Sub-Phases"

    I just had the idea of "sub-phases" in Revit, which I think could help tremendously with large projects that have various "phases" in the construction scheduling, but the overall project is one single construction project. And maybe there's some other way of doing this that I'm not aware of.

    Take for example a large industrial facility renovation project. The client must remain in operation during the project, so the construction of different areas must happen in phases. One area gets finished, client moves operations into that new area, then the previous area gets renovated, and so on.

    I have such a project now where I set up various phases of work, in order to be able to show plan views of what happens when, and what needs to happen in the Owner's existing areas while the new work is going on. The problem is that I can't show a single overall plan with ALL of the new construction shown in one place, differentiated graphically from the existing construction.

    If I set it to the last phase and Project Complete, everything shows up as new construction. If I set it to Show Previous + New, then all the previous construction phases override to Existing, the same as the actual existing building construction. If I just put it all on one phase and try to show the different phased areas graphically on one floor plan, then I can't show what needs to happen during interim periods when transitioning between new and old spaces.

    I would love to see "sub-phases" within an overall construction phase. Set the view to the sub-phase to see what's new on that particular phase only, or set it to the "parent" phase to see what's new for the overall construction project in relation to the existing-to-remain elements. Likewise, a Demo plan set to the parent phase would show everything being demolished in the project, or if set to the sub-phase will show only what gets demolished for that particular construction phase.

    I thought of graphic filters, but you can't filter by Phase Created and Phase Demolished unfortunately. What else is there, overlaying 2 separate views on a sheet, set to different phases? Then I would have to hide all the previous phase elements in the view set to the later phase, so that the previous phase elements in the other view would also display as New. And if I add elements after setting up the views, then I have to always be sure to go into the other view and hide them. Sounds like a coordination nightmare.
    Last edited by PatrickGSR94; December 14, 2017, 02:55 PM.

    #2
    Or- instead of introducing a hypothetical and potentially convoluted feature that doesnt even know how it handles things like Rooms, Areas, partial demolition, annotations for various sub phases and all of that- you could:

    1. Use a ten-minute-to-make-Dynamo graph that needs no external packages
    2. Pull the un-Filterable Phase data in to brand new Parameters of your making (including Shared Parameters)
    3. Filter them how you want, with the Floor plan set to Latest Phase and Show Completion.
    4. Added bonus of doing it this way is you could still show *existing* as *existing* using a Filter on *Existing* lol.

    Or request an even simple feature, that they let us Filter by the damn Phase data, LOL.

    But yeah, you can do it with Dynamo.

    Graph is attached. Obviously you want more than walls, so add more categories and form a list at the front, instead of just using All elements of Category hard coded to walls. Or use the Rhythm Node that does the badass "collect all model elements" thing.
    Attached Files
    Aaron "selfish AND petulant" Maller |P A R A L L A X T E A M | Practice Technology Implementation
    @Web | @Twitter | @LinkedIn | @Email

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      #3
      so you have to add additional manual parameters for Phase Created and Phase Demolished, to keep track of in addition to the hard-coded phasing info? Still sounds like a coordination nightmare. Yeah there are other things that would have to be figured out with sub-phases, but I still think it could be useful for showing the progression of how things are actually built.

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        #4
        You have to create two parameters, sure. Or put them in your template, and never deal with it again. Other than that, Dynamo is filling the data out for you, so its not a coordination nightmare unless you dont run the graph.

        But, i guess as an alternative, we can discuss a feature that doesnt exist, isnt on the current roadmap, isnt fully thought through or articulated, and wont help you solve your problem on a project for the next 18 months.

        Im game for that as well. My bad. It sounded like something youre doing on a current job, so i thought id offer up a solution. Carry on.
        Aaron "selfish AND petulant" Maller |P A R A L L A X T E A M | Practice Technology Implementation
        @Web | @Twitter | @LinkedIn | @Email

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          #5
          It's just an idea, nothing more. Yeah the parameters would be in the template, but if you change an element's Phase Created or Phase Demolished, don't you also have to change the corresponding Shared Parameter at the same time, for each element? Is that not a manual process when demolishing elements in a model?

          Or is that what Dynamo is doing. Sorry I'm not proficient in Dynamo by any stretch of the imagination. I've tried a couple of tutorials but that's it. Haven't had time to do anything else with it.
          Last edited by PatrickGSR94; December 14, 2017, 03:44 PM.

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            #6
            I wuz gonna say to ask the Factory to make the Phasing Filterable on the Revit Ideas site, but if you need a fastest work-around then Aaron just gave it to ya. I wuz also gonna state sumtin similar to wut A-A-Ron just stipulated, but without the Dynamo factor. Thanks A-A-Ron. Wish I could have used this method on my LAX T1 reno/addition project that had 8 phases for their modernization program, which they had the phasing play Hot Potatoes for a bit while doing demo tasks to stay in budget. What fun it was to "UN-Demo", lol.

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              #7
              Would it be a very dumb idea to use worksets as subphase. Or doesn't the Revit let you play that game? 'Layerminded user :P
              Last edited by HansLammerts; December 14, 2017, 04:43 PM.

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                #8
                Originally posted by PatrickGSR94 View Post
                It's just an idea, nothing more. Yeah the parameters would be in the template, but if you change an element's Phase Created or Phase Demolished, don't you also have to change the corresponding Shared Parameter at the same time, for each element? Is that not a manual process when demolishing elements in a model?

                Or is that what Dynamo is doing. Sorry I'm not proficient in Dynamo by any stretch of the imagination. I've tried a couple of tutorials but that's it. Haven't had time to do anything else with it.
                You literally would click the *run* button once, before each time you had to print those drawings, and it would update every single objects "manual parameters" in the model.

                Worksets as sub-phases: Opinions vary. IMHO using worksets for ANY kind of visibility control, is absolute garbage. But for this specifically, it would be even worse, since turning off a worksets visibility doesnt make it "not join" or "not exist," it just makes it so you cant see it. So you really want items TRULY phased in revit, or everything else (Room boundaries, area boundaries, wall joins, and so on) will be hosed.
                Aaron "selfish AND petulant" Maller |P A R A L L A X T E A M | Practice Technology Implementation
                @Web | @Twitter | @LinkedIn | @Email

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                  #9
                  A sub-phase would be no better because it isn’t the phase assignment preventing what you describe. It is the Phase Filtering logic. The bias is, in a given view, all past phases are existing. It needs to be possible to say all phase assignments beyond “this phase” are “new”. The existing phase is existing in name only.

                  Yes, it is semantics. You call them a sub-phase and I think of the “existing” being a fixed point in time all work following is regarded as new. It seems to me the solution Aaron provides gets the graphic result without redesign of the feature, which is years in the making.

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by PatrickGSR94 View Post
                    so you have to add additional manual parameters for Phase Created and Phase Demolished,
                    FWIW I "copy/transpose" inaccessible data parts and push them into SPs all the time (though had never thought to do phases until reading this thread).

                    I've always been a big fan of collapsed schedules to play "pairs", but more and more these days I'm playing with Dynamo, with (almost) "magic button" affect! Of course you have to remember to hit run now and then, but if you add a "Last manipulated by Dynamo" date stamp SP also, you and everyone else gets a visual checking aid.


                    To add a query/suggestion.

                    Do you ever seek to do more with these "sub-phases" beyond plan representation? I mean, do the VG/VT Phase Filter limitations upset your elevation, section, RCP, detail, 3D, or scheduling work? Because if not, there are always area plans that could be used to draw over your model old school style. Whilst not very "BIMmy" - and in no way as efficient as filters, areas can offer alternative (primarily annotative) benefits to staying purely elemental - so could be an option?

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