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Thread: Modelling etiquette for walls?

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    Member KWilkinson's Avatar
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    Modelling etiquette for walls?

    Hi all,

    Bit of a newbie question here. Attached is a excerpt from an AutoCAD plan around a window opening. The outer face is stone and the inner face common block.

    My question is how much detail would you expect to cover in the the Revit model itself and how much would you cover in details? I'm really trying to wrap my head around the approach you need to take when working with Revit on an architecturally complex design.

    (I have more questions on this depending on the answers to this first stage).

    Cheers

    Keith.
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    The Moderator with No Imagination MPwuzhere's Avatar
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    I'd build something like that with multiple walls....keeping a separate plan with dimensioned reference planes (on their own workset so they don't show in other plans) so that I can lock the walls to them.

    But yeah, definitely doable in Revit.

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    Member kommunalka's Avatar
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    This is an ongoing discussion in many firms...

    ...Typically, all details beyond a specific scale... say 1"=1'-0" or 1 1/2" = 1'-0" Will typically be drawn using detail components rather than live model geometry.

    However, there is no consensus on this method, as many Firms draft all details in revit while others strive to detail/model as much content as possible.

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    Member KWilkinson's Avatar
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    Would it be considered bad protocol to model the internal leaf as a block wall with a plasterboard finish and then use a separate wall item to all the stone cladding? This would allow me to model the wall as I see it here but I'm not sure it there would be catastrophic knock on effects further down the line with say scheduling, QTO etc...

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    Forum Co-Founder Twiceroadsfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kommunalka View Post
    This is an ongoing discussion in many firms...

    ...Typically, all details beyond a specific scale... say 1"=1'-0" or 1 1/2" = 1'-0" Will typically be drawn using detail components rather than live model geometry.

    However, there is no consensus on this method, as many Firms draft all details in revit while others strive to detail/model as much content as possible.
    The firms that want to do it right (sorry, its true) use modeled content as much as possible. If you go in our 1" details (even our 3" details) you will find that the modeled wall is still there, and is providing the hatch for the brick and masonry. That is how we assure that the wall types havent changed. Our detail components are hatchless outlines with masking regions for joints, and detail components for other ancillary unmodeled things.

    Its entirely not true that details past a "certain scale" are completely drafted.
    Parametric Snowman and Drew like this.

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    BIM there, done that cliff collins's Avatar
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    .....Agreed!

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    Forum Co-Founder Twiceroadsfool's Avatar
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    BTW, Null values (blank, or not checked or unchecked) only exist until a value is input. They cannot go back to Null afterwards, but Text fields can be blank.

    EDIT: I posted this reply in the wrong thread, LOL.

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    BIM there, done that cliff collins's Avatar
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    ......Agreed!

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    Forum Co-Founder Twiceroadsfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by K.. View Post
    Would it be considered bad protocol to model the internal leaf as a block wall with a plasterboard finish and then use a separate wall item to all the stone cladding? This would allow me to model the wall as I see it here but I'm not sure it there would be catastrophic knock on effects further down the line with say scheduling, QTO etc...
    Not bad protocol at all. In fact, its our office standard that Backup walls and Finish walls are modeled entirely seperate. Brick and air space (or brick with no air space, thats offset) are modeled seperate of the exterior backup wall. Stone as well. And wood finishes, and anything thicker than wallpaper.

    EDIT: It works better with scheduling and QTO as well. The only things it affects negatively are:

    1. If you use a type tag on your walls that includes finishes, it doesnt work out. (But i never have in any of my offices)
    2. Exporting to GBXML gets a bit squirrely.
    3. Any hosted content that needs to respect the Jamb thickness needs to be custom built (all of ours is).

    You also end up with way LESS wall types. All included means your number of wall types are BackupVariations x Finishvariations. Modeling them seperately, your wall tops drop to Backupvariations PLUS Finishvariations. WAY less walls.
    Last edited by Twiceroadsfool; January 17th, 2013 at 05:51 PM.
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    Member kommunalka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twiceroadsfool View Post
    The firms that want to do it right (sorry, its true) use modeled content as much as possible. If you go in our 1" details (even our 3" details) you will find that the modeled wall is still there, and is providing the hatch for the brick and masonry. That is how we assure that the wall types havent changed. Our detail components are hatchless outlines with masking regions for joints, and detail components for other ancillary unmodeled things.

    Its entirely not true that details past a "certain scale" are completely drafted.
    Perhaps my language was a bit too declarative [black and white]

    I only meant to state that there is an ongoing discussion as to what is live and what is drafted, and not a unified solution [yet].

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